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tv   MSNBC Live With Jose Diaz- Balart  MSNBC  April 5, 2016 6:00am-8:01am PDT

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good morning, everybody, it's election day, tuesday, i'm savannah guthrie. >> and what year are we in? >> is this 2010. >> >> are you savannah? where are we? it's 9:00 a.m. >> this is really old days, this is old school. >> real old school. >> we used to do this every day. >> the polls are open across wisconsin for what is a big test for the remaining presidential candidates, both front runners, hillary clinton, donald trump, well, guess what, they are the underdogs today in wisconsin. but there's arguably more drama on the republican side. we've been saying that all year long. the question today, can ted cruz change the trajectory of the gop race with a big double digit win tonight? 42 republican delegates are up for grabs in wisconsin and the candidates are battling for every last one of them, congressional district by congressional district. a loss by trump will make it much more difficult for him to win the nomination outright, but
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how much does he lose by if he does? you know what that means, folks, the first open convention in decades if indeed it is a bad night for him. >> you just got chills. >> i get goose bumps. we have to figure this out. it's kind of nice. could be, i think. >> it could be interesting for political junkies such as yourself. >> good for cleveland. >> high interest. >> especially if lebron fizzles. final days have been filled with trump lashing out against the rnc over rules, lashing out against ted cruz who is rushing to get last minute ads on the air. the only common ground is they are tired of john kasich. but the ohio governor says he's not getting out. >> we're winning by almost 300 delegates so we're doing great and i think we close it out before the -- you know, before the convention. >> just a few weeks ago the media was all saying wisconsin was a perfect state for donald trump to win, was not a good state for me to compete in.
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what we are seeing happening in wisconsin is the unity of the republican party manifesting. >> press is like, oh, well, you're getting a few sharper elbows now, why is that? i said i want to tell you something, i'm not a marshmallow or a pin cushion. you want to take a whack at me, let's get it on. >> some cowboy words there. >> get it on. >> democrats by the way also voting today and this race in wisconsin is as tight as it gets. bernie sanders would need at least a double digit win to even make a dent in hillary clinton's pledged delegate lead. polls show him now with either a small or a moderate advantage depending on which one you look at but just like the republicans tonight's results are as much about momentum as anything. after tonight it will be two weeks until the next big contest in new york on the 19th. overnight at long last the democrats finally settled on adding another debate not
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calendar. we love debates over debates, don't we? >> they're better sometimes than the debates themselves. >> it's happening wednesday in brooklyn five days before the primary day. >> most important thing about having a debate in brooklyn. >> what? >> a lot of beasty boys. >> you're going to go right for the beasty boys. no sleep until brooklyn. our reporters are out, out on the ground in wisconsin. >> let's start with jacob rascon covering the trump campaign and is in milwaukee with news on how trump is going to pay for the wall, believe it or not, he put out some details on this. although the legality of it all is something that a lot of people will chew over. jacob, tell us about it. >> reporter: this may be the most detailed plan we have seen from trump on anything, this is his signature position, building the wall, his favorite line in rallies, in a two-page memo he sent to the washington post he is saying he would threaten to cut off remittances which would require him to change part of the u.s. patriot act and as well fees obvious sasse, but he says
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all of this, these are just threats and what he's saying is that if mexico will pay a one time payment of 5 to $10 billion, which is what it would cost he says to build the ball he would take these threats away, but it's a very detailed plan, mexico gets billions of dollars in money transfers from those family members who live here to there, it's been going on for many years and so threaten to do that, to one of our biggest allies, is a big deal and as you said, chuck, the legality of it all would test the powers of the executive branch, whether he can actually do that, but again he says it's just a threat, all of this just a threat, it's part of his art of the deal, his book that he wrote of course in order to get people to do what he wants them to do which is build this wall, his signature position. >> all right, jacob, thanks very much. i have to say did you read this plan? >> i just told me about it right now. >> the remittances, this idea. >> that's a fancy word for saying you have folks who live here and they're sending money
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to their families in mexico. >> he believes he can stop all wire transfers to mexico. >> make it illegal to do so. >> how he's going to pull that off legality, i don't know, but the other part is money finds a way. you cut off one way, i mean, already legally you get people doing bit coin. how he pulls this off in the global 21st century way where you can move money in so many different ways. >> really what he seems to be arguing is that's just a threat. i will threaten to do that if you don't pony up the money for the wall, mexico. >> look, we've all been beating him up for saying how are you going to do this. he put something on paper. >> okay. all right. it's really just in so we have to see what the experts have to say about it. let's go over to the cruz campaign, hallie jackson is in milwaukee, she has been covering the candidate and will be with him again all day. we were reading in the "new york times" this morning, hallie, about how the cruz campaign is getting more and more openly frustrated with john kasich remaining in the race. >> reporter: yeah, and he is and
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you're seeing that on the campaign trail. you're seeing him talk more about john kasich, talk more about how he believes and talking explicitly by the way that he and donald trump will be the only ones left on that convention ballot come july given that he says rules are rules, implying that neither he nor trump's delegates will try to make maneuvers in the rules committee to do anything to help john kasich obviously. that is one of the things that we'ven been seeing from cruz as he has been talking more in wisconsin and doing these campaign events yesterday. today right now he is down here in milwaukee, his family is in town, his daughters and his wife, he will be holding an event later today at sir paul, you saw sarah palin come out and speak friday night. the campaign is feeling confident, an aid tells me this morning that they will be victorious here potentially by double digits, they are feeling that they will do well with the somewhat conservatives, the mod rats, as we watch the exit polls cruz has traditionally done well
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with the very conservative groups in places like you a that you and iowa but this state looks different for him and that's what the campaign is pointing to. you heard cruz talk about this himself saying wisconsin looks a lot more like indiana and pennsylvania setting himself up for potentially some success there, states where frankly it looks difficult for him to pull out a win against trump. >> plus they are the one campaign that's doing work in colorado, work in north dakota. they are being able to play three-dimensional chess, the request he is whether the trump campaign can. hallie jackson, thanks very much. >> let's bring in former senior advisory to rand paul lease jordan along with perry caken. how are you? >> thanks for having me. >> perry, you are the remote guy so we will start with you first, give you some -- since alias has the home field advantage in new york. watching told complaining about kasich, i want to start there because it seems as if sometimes kasich gets -- he's rodney
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danger field, his best argument for staying in is imagine if i had gotten out before ohio. >> he might be the best general election candidate of the three so if he went to a von vengs maybe he could somehow win. it seems hard to imagine how he wins but if you're ted cruz i understand the point which is even today i would argue cruz is the big favorite, trump will finish in second, but in a race where there was no kasich you can imagine cruz maybe getting all the delegates here or a large polarity of them. so i understand while kasich still has a right to run you can tell he's getting inn degree nant as that clip you showed saying he should get out of the race. >> he's getting it on all sides because trump has been saying you ought to get out of the race. here is an idea that unites cruz and trump. it's not immediately obvious to me anyway that kasich voters would go running to trump. >> i think you're absolutely right, i don't think they are at all and i think it's just a
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distraction for donald trump because he had such a terrible week and it's drawing people away. if he's complaining about kasich people aren't talking about the horrible things that he has been saying about women and that's the narrative that i am really watching and i want to see how it impacts tonight. and if going forward it is because you can't have three-quarters of american women strongly dislike you and be a strong general election nominee. >> so trump yesterday first of all had three rallies, he sort of understands the stakes of wisconsin, you have to give him that, they know that, that's why they did -- did melania help yesterday? brought her out, had her speak. the american public doesn't yet know her very well. is she a good character witness for him? >> i think that she probably is, but i think it's really irrelevant at this point. i think so much damage has been done the entire campaign from his obsession with megyn kelly to his campaign manager being arrested for assault, for, you know, the comments that he made that women should be punished for abortion, i think it's so many things and it's been such a
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sustained drum beat that there is no way of escaping this narrative that trump is not a friend of women. i'm a young republican woman and i certainly feel he is not my friend. >> let's talk about the democrats and all the polls really show that this is going to be a very tight race in wisconsin and in some ways it feels like hillary clinton may already be looking more toward new york and that's a must win for her, isn't it? >> i think new york is a must win. the important thing about today, most important i think in both races on some level is wisconsin has about 12% of its population is black and hispanic, compared to 30% in the country. hillary has done well in states that are fairly diverse, wisconsin is not a very diverse state, new york is. and new york is her home state, she really has to win new york. i think that's key for her today. i don't expect -- i would be surprised if she won tonight basically because of those demographics and she's facing a state without a lot of african-americans particularly and that's her biggest base in this primary so far is black voters. >> you know, perry, we look
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today. if she pulls off the upset, right, if she wins narrowly, does that -- it's interesting to hear sanders saying after he wins wisconsin then it's on to go beat ner in new york. i thought it was refreshing to hear sanders realistically set his own bar basically saying, hey, i have to beat her in both of these states if i'm going to keep pressing this case saying i have a realistic shot at beating her. at the same time the reverse is true, if he blows it, right? >> yeah, if he wins wisconsin, a state like -- think about madison, wisconsin, is the ultimate bernie sanders place other than burlington, vermont, if he loses wisconsin a state like i said very little diversity, very liberal state in the democratic party it is problematic for him. he's down in the delegates anyway, but wisconsin would be a huge blow momentum wise. new york, like i said, demographics are harder for sanders, hillary is from there, it would be hard to see -- i'm not sure where why he's saying he's going to win new york, that's hard to imagine. >> elise jordan with us, thank
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you. and perry bacon down in washington, d.c. thank you to both of you. msnbc is a place for politics, chuck will kick off our coverage of the wisconsin primary tonight, "meet the press" daily 5:00 p.m. eastern, chuck never sleeps. >> no. >> we are going to start getting exit poll results from the badger state, you can continue watching the team on the wisconsin results throughout the evening right here on msnbc. >> my favorite part of wisconsin was when with you decide to become a packer fan? how soon in the process did you become -- that's going to be one of the questions on the polls. >> that's one of the exit poll questions. >> we want to know, new packer fans, old packer fans, how does that influence your vote. i think it matters. it's huge. >> coming up, bernie sanders turns up the heat on hillary clinton. >> between you and me i don't want to get hillary clinton more nervous than she already is, she's already under a lot of pressure. so don't tell her this. but i think we win here, we win in new york state we are on our way to the white house.
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thank you all very much. >> raising his own expectations, a refreshing honesty from candidates running from president. he is hoping for the big badger state win tonight and that it somehow spring boards him to pull the upset in new york. is that possible? we will check in with his campaign manager after the break. hey! this is lloyd. to prove to you that the better choice for him is aleve. he's agreed to give it up. ok, but i have 30 acres to cover by sundown. we'll be with him all day as he goes back to taking tylenol. yeah, i was ok, but after lunch my knee started hurting again so... more pills. yep... another pill stop. can i get my aleve back yet? for my pain... i want my aleve. get all day minor arthritis pain relief with an easy open cap. thope to see you again soon.. whoa, whoa, i got this. just gotta get the check.
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xfinity lets you download your shows from anywhere. i used to like that song. polling station in green bay, wisconsin, where bernie sanders hopes to build on his momentum in today's democratic primary, voting is already under way. >> green bay is one of my favorite counties to watch tonight, it's a swing county in general elections. green bay a working class community, obviously besides my love for the packers, but this
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is sanders/trump voters, where they go back and forth. >> they could affect each other. >> they could have an impact. brown county of interest to me in general. sanders coming off recent wins in five of six states, wisconsin could be his last chance to reset the race with hillary clinton. new nbc news survey monk renational online poll the weekly tracking poll we have been doing out this morning does have secretary clinton gaining a couple points over senator sanders in the past week, she now holds is 9 point lead nationally. on the campaign trail today, though, hillary clinton will attend a women for hillary town hall not in wisconsin, in brooklyn this afternoon. bernie sanders is looking ahead to saturday's contend in wyoming and will hold a rally in laramie later this evening. up for us is nbc's kristen welker. hello. >> hello. >> wait a minute. i look over for a second and, bang, washington comes to -- >> kelly just slid into home, i go he is. >> it was as smooth as the nats winning a gave against the
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braves on opening day. >> the sports analogies. >> i can always get it done. >> you are a bottomless pit of sports analogies. >> it was opening day, the ncaa -- this was huge. this was a huge 24 hours a sports. leave me alone. >> the only time you are not talking about sports is when you are talking about the beastie boys. >> green bay packers and wisconsin. come on. >> let's talk politics, that's why we're here. okay. wisconsin, you're covering sanders, you're covering clinton and it's going to be neck and neck. you guys can slug it out for who gets to answer first. >> the clinton campaign has been down playing expectations for wisconsin for quite some time now, look at her schedule today, she has this event in brooklyn and then a fundraising event tonight. she has no big rally tonight, i mean, they are ready to turn the page not only on wisconsin, but on this chapter because as you just said, chuck, senator sanders has won the past five states. they're ready to move on to new york which is a critical state for her, it's sort of all hands on deck here, bill clinton has a
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number of events here throughout the day, she's been here for the past several days really hitting the ground and trying to, you know, rally her base here. she cannot lose new york, the optics of that would be horrible. we've been talking about matt versus momentum, the margins tonight will be really significant. senator sanders looks like he's poised for a win, if he wins by a few points he gets a due delegates and momentum, but if he wins by larger, maybe double digits that obviously a lot more momentum and more delegates and could be more significant. >> you know, kelly, it is interesting on that front. you have margin here is what matters. a 3, 4 -- a win the size of michigan, yeah, it's nice, but then this is yet another state that kind of sanders had some advantages going in and he picks up a net of 3 or 4 delegates. >> being in the crowd at some of his events in wisconsin the thing that is most striking is the depth of the energy, the excitement, the willingness in wisconsin cold temperatures it's still winter there regardless of the calendar for people to stand
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outside for hours wanting to see him. the thunderous atmosphere inside the halls, arenas, gymnasiums, that's really striking. and the fact that he can give basically the same message, the same strump speech, there are times i find my lips moving along because i know what's coming next and it still fires up the people who have waited to see him. it has to be a significant inn with, he believes it can be and he's trying to inspire voters who paying close enough attention to know that margin matters to really push and show up for him. >> at long last they've settled on a date for a debate. what's interesting about that is actually not the back and forth but how it shows the level which the campaigns are. that -- maybe vitriol is too strong a word but they are seriously irritate wd each other. >> it's gotten a lot uglier, this campaign started out as the civil campaign when you compared it to the republican race but think about what we've seen in the past several days, they had
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this big fight over who got more money from oil and gas companies, turns out they both accept money from oil and gas employees, and then this debate which kind of made both of them look a little petty, they have finally decided on a date. to the point that kelly was making, though, on the energy of the crowds, i think it underscores the staying power of senator sanders because what we learned yesterday is that he outraised her by $15 million. so where she's going to be tonight, she's going to be fundraising. this is something that costs her time and money. >> okay. i will move myally so we can have the debate so you are at your fundraiser. >> which is true. her schedule is really busy over the next two weeks, it's not for campaign rallies and a whole bunch of april 26 primary states it's fundraising symptoms, it's miamis, the dallass, the l.a.s, she's doing the standard democraticschedule.
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>> not the calendar she would have had had she put this away shoo she's still looking for primary dough. >> i think they're solidifying the donor community to be ready to jump to her aid in terms of not only the money but trying to unify the party. when you're going up against a candidate who has brought out such grass roots energy getting the establishment part of the party help is necessary but also maybe not as optically helpful. >> think about the memo that her campaign manager sent out i think it was a month ago saying we expect to have this race locked up by the end of march. guess what, we are in april and i think that that speaks to why you're seeing this guess increasingly uglier. >> if they can't get it locked up by the end of this month then we are going to the convention. >> right. >> there really is suddenly no more room. now, i think they have that possibility, but it's now incumbent upon them to actually -- >> do you think super delegates are in play the way the sanders campaign thinks they could be? >> super delegates are going to
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be -- they will always be receptive to a voter pitch. the reason i say this -- >> they are office holders themselves. >> correct. if thing voting against bernie will cost them their own primary some day, suddenly -- that's the leverage bernie could have with some of these folks and bernie people, they could go, okay, you're going to vote against sanders who won your state? we're going to primary you. watch out. >> but i think in order to do that he really has to convince them i can win the nomination. barack obama did that in 2008. >> he's got to beat her in a state that she's favored in. he keeps winning, kelly, states that, oh -- >> the layout is good for him, the college groups, the type of voter, there is the caucuses format. >> where can he win where it was like, oh, that was something she should have twoen? >> that's why new york is so critical. >> it all leads to new york. okay. >> that's why we're here. >> kelly and kristen, thank you.
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>> i'm going to do my sort of anti-new york vibe that i like to throw out every once in awhile. really? because new york will matter. >> not when you're here in new york. >> new york will be the center of the universe and deserves it. >> guys, thank you. let's bring in bernie sanders campaign manager jeff weaver. mr. weaver, let me start with something your candidate said last night because i thought it was refreshingly honest where he basically said we're going to win in wisconsin, win in new york and then we will win this nomination. that to me he's right, if you work backwards and somehow you see him getting the nomination in philadelphia, it begins with a big win tonight and an upset in new york, but if you don't win new york you can't win the nomination. >> no, i don't think that's true, chuck. look, we've mapped out a path to victory in our campaign in terms of delegates, pledged delegates, we don't have to win everywhere but we do have to win most of the states coming up. there is no one state that's a must win.
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as we look forward we will be able to accumulate the delegates we need to get the pledged delegate lead by the end of this primary and caucus process. >> jeff, savannah guthrie here. i'm sure you've head this article in the "new york times" that suggested that there's some regret in the ranks of the sanders too em that sanders didn't go after hillary clinton earlier, more aggressively and that if he had you might be in a little bit of a different situation today. what do you make of that? do you buy into it? >> well, let me tell you what i told the "new york times" is usually when you write an oi bit wear you have to have a dead body first. we're going to the convention, we won six of the last seven contests all of them overwhelmingly with the kind of lead we are going to need to accumulate the delegates we need between now and the end of this process. "the new york times" can opine about this and that but the truth of the matter is this campaign has demonstrated that it has the momentum, bernie sanders' message is resonating with people out in the country and we have a tremendous amount
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of wind at our back right now. >> to that point, though, that it raises and i take your point on the idea that it was maybe a premature writing of an obituary but is there anything to the concept that maybe there should have been a more aggressive strategy to go after hillary clinton earlier? >> no, look, bernie sanders has been very clear from the beginning, this is going to be a campaign about issues, he has been contrasting his record of standing up for working families in this country for his entire career against hillary clinton sort of the centrist pro corporate position since the beginning of this campaign. he has been very clear about the kind of campaign he wants to run, he has run it in a very effective way as we can see by his standing. when this thing started he was at 3% and all of you on this feed thought that he was a fringe candidate. well, i think what he has demonstrated is that he has the support of tens and tens of millions of people across this uncountry. >> in the last few days secretary clinton has implied that bernie sanders' loyalty to the democratic party is not that
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deep, that basically he became a democrat for convenience to run for president, yesterday she was asked about this idea when she said it's important we elect more democrats i would love to see the senate go back to being more democratic and saying that bernie sanders want to do that and she says there has been no indication that he is interested in building the party, electing more democrats. to me that sounds like a super delegate pitch, the counter argument to what you guys are trying to make. >> look, this is the problem with the clinton campaign that they don't want to talk about. in terms of electing democrats in the fall we will need a presidential candidate who will create a wave like president obama did in 2008, hillary clinton has demonstrated that she is not that candidate, she cannot do that. her support among independence is horrendous, she barrel gets 25% of independence and those are democratic leaning independence. >> right. >> democratic candidate for president you can't win independence you can't win and you are not going to bring anybody with you. >> but, you know, one of your
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pitches has been bernie sanders he motivates people there's real enthusiasm for him. hillary clinton has gotten more raw vote than bernie sanders has and turnouts aren't up that often. if there were a revolution and enthusiasm were on sanders' side wouldn't he be the top vote getter in the primary process not hillary clinton? >> i think if you look at what happened in nevada the other day hillary clinton had 4,900 delegates elected to the clark county nevada county convention we had 4,000. those are people who were elected at precinct caucuses it's not an insider game. the people who were there for us were not insiders, those 3,000 people i guarantee you they were not insiders. >> this is about expanding the electorate. >> and he is expanding the electorate beyond the p traditional base. if bernie sanders is the whom knee he will get the overwhelming support of democrats in this race.
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who can capture young people and independence in in race to bring them out and have them vote in the general election so we can elect not just bernie sanders but democrats up and down the ballot. hak is not going to do that. all these young people coming out for bernie sanders will they come out for hillary clinton? i'm not so confident about that. >> jeff weaver, good luck today. thanks for being with us. coming up next, it could be a big night for ted cruz, polls show the texas senator leading heading into today's primary. could a win in wisconsin help cruz slow down donald trump's momentum and what it could mean for the future of the republican race. we will get one cruz supporter's take right after this break. >> this race has national implications, the entire country is looking to wisconsin. i would note just a few weeks ago the media was all saying wisconsin was a perfect state for donald trump to win, was not a good state for me to compete in. incentives, the lowest taxes in decades, and new infrastructure for a new generation
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donald trump recently questioned whether your governor could ride a harley.
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i would encourage donald come on down. i think scott would be happy to give donald a ride, maybe give him a little side cart that he could hold on to. you're right, it would mess up his hair. actually, i don't know that it would. it might be that 100 miles an hour that might not move. >> wow. ted cruz -- it's stand up, it was late night in waukesha last night. >> victory for him could do two things, bolster the stop donald trump movement and prove that he could win among more moderate voters in wisconsin. right now we're joined by steve
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monigan. forgive me but you are the chair of the new jersey campaign so i think i can get away with this, let's move past wisconsin for a movement. >> we can. >> how does cruz win in states like a new jersey, like a new york, she is are necessarily his strong holds? >> by competing on the i wish auto us, the issues that are critically important for republican voters and donald trump his positions can change from morning to noon to the afternoon, particularly on issues like education. let me give you an example. today is the first day of common core testing across new york, new jersey and the rest of the country. this is a big issue in the republican primary. donald trump several months ago said he would eliminate the department of education, then we heard from ben carson that he's going to make ben carson the head of the department of education, then last week in a stunning statement he says the role of federal government is education and healthcare and security. there's nothing conservatives disagree with more than to say the federal government is going to run education and healthcare. these issues will resonate with voters across these states. >> but will they? i take your point but on the
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other hand he had five positions last week on abortion and have we seen -- we will see what happens in wisconsin today but have these inconsistencies have they really had any affect on his campaign so far? >> if you look at what's happened the last two weeks, two weeks a massive landslide victory for doctor you see in utah, large in utah over the weekend, taking 17 or 18 out of 19 delegates, two wins in colorado picking up six more delegates, it's been total momentum for ted cruz because of his consistency on the issues while donald trump continues to flounder all over the place. wisconsin voters are paying attention to this. >> after today if there is a double digit win does senator cruz sort of change a little bit in this respect, not saying he changes his position but changes his focus in talking about issues that he thinks might actually appeal to a kasich voter? you talk about one in five republican voters who are more of the business wing of the party, you know, maybe they want to deemphasize social issues and
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as you move to the northeast where social issues take a back seat do we see ted cruz do that? >> i think we see ted cruz taking an even clearer stand on the issues. john kasich has to deal with the issue of medicaid and medicaid funding and that he supports common core, big issue for new york and new jersey voters. donald trump's inconsistencies will continue to resonate more. what's going to happen after a big win in wisconsin ted will continue to accelerate in the polls, there is no doubt we are mind in new york, we understand that, but we have a long race ahead, two weeks happens to be a long time in a presidential primary, a lot of time for ted to clarify his issues. there's one element that i noticed, guys, and i wanted to get this in, there's one word that i've seen associated with donald trump over the last several months and that's the word threat, he's going to threaten mexico, threaten companies that have leave the country, threaten europe with nuclear weapons on the table to negotiate with our allies in europe. i mean, the word threat is not a word that should be associated with the president of the united states and i think voters are i can waking up to this kind of
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thing. >> so you think that this should be the next path of cruz basically saying what trump is doing by threatening people that this is an undemocratic way to campaign? >> that is everything the founding fathers developed our constitution to defend this country against, this idea of a strong man, dig day for y'all president. >> you think trump is an authoritarian? >> i think he is an authoritarian but that's not the american way and northeastern voters are not going to buy that over time. there's going to be a lot of work ahead i'm not saying ted cruz will win new york but we will fight hard to win those delegates across new york. we have put our effort into gathering those delegates who will be on the convention floor and nominate ted cruz on most likely the second or third ballot. >> good to have you here. >> honesty again realizing you can't win on the first if you do this this is a second or third ballot. >> nobody thinks that.
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>> all right. thanks. >> we are all for candor around here. >> pro candor. sanders has done t you're doing it. nothing wrong with that. >> thank you. >> all right. the polls have been open for the past two and a half hours in wisconsin, this is a live picture inside a polling station in green bay because that's how we show our bias here, pro packer bias. we will check up with our reporters across the entire state of wisconsin. how big will turnout be and where will independent voters go? we will be right back. e a bankel to the most remote locations with nothing but a phone and a tablet. everywhere where there's a phone, you have a bank. now a person is able to start a business, and employ somebody for the first time. the microsoft cloud helped us to bring banking to ten million people in just two years. it's transforming our world.
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business owners get started. visit legalzoom today for the legal help you need to start and run your business. legalzoom. legal help is here. welcome back. donald trump still campaigning in wisconsin, chris jansing has been on wisconsin duty. i feel like for weeks, chris. i mean, you know, i think you've got residency there. >> free chris. >> have you voted today? >> reporter: not quite. i am not officially a resident here but look who showed up in
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wakesha. maybe not a big surprise chuck and savannah. if anybody was going to show up as donald trump gets pictures taken with the many volunteers. >> bring him over. let him know -- >> reporter: i promise i will let him get these pictures taken and then we will talk to him. this is one of the three most reliable republican counties in the country and trump when you drive in here there were signs everywhere, there were people who were lined up and so he has come here, he's thanking people, he has said it's going to be a food day, let's go in and see if we can get him to answer a question for two. how are you feeling this morning. >> we feel great. the turnout has been fantastic, we had a poll come out last time, a pollster that called south carolina, i wasn't supposed to win south carolina we won in a landslide, chris, and we feel really good about this. >> reporter: i want to give you a chance to answer these reports that there is a lot of inn fighting in your campaign, that it's in a state somewhat of
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disarray. >> i haven't heard those reports. we have a great campaign, i'm number one by a lot. millions more votes than cruz or anybody else. i have millions of more votes as you know. i have almost 300 more delegates, i have not heard anything about infighting. i don't know where you hear it. >> reporter: well, it's being reported and there are people within your campaign who are suggesting -- >> i'm the only -- i doubt that. >> reporter: you feel confident that your campaign is all working together, none of the people who have been brought in -- >> let me ask you are we number one? >> reporter: you are number one. >> do we have millions nor votes than anybody else? will we win today i can't tell you but we will have a great turnout and i think we're going to do very well. >> reporter: it's not uncommon when things seem to not be doing as well as they might have been, i know you disagree with some of the assessments, a lot of people have said not your greatest week. >> i have had worse weeks on the campaigns, i have had a couple that were worse. in one case i went up in the polls. you know, couldn't have been so disastrous, we have a very, very good campaign going, i'm number
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one by a lot and, you know, the thing that nobody talks about are the votes. i'm millions of votes more than anybody else. we talk about delegates, which are by far and away number one but the votes are even more itch sieve because i have -- if you take a look is it close to 3 million more votes than the second place person. we're doing really well. i had not heard anything about the inner fighting of the campaign, but we have a successful campaign going and i think we will keep it going. >> reporter: let me ask you about going on from here. how important is wisconsin and if ted cruz is able to win here does it substantially make it harder for you to go into cleveland and assure a win? >> well, ted cruz can't win. there is no way he can get the delegates and everybody has said that, all of your friends and everybody that i've watched has said that it's impossible. almost impossible for ted cruz to win. so he would have to get it at the convention, which i think would be highly unlikely. so he can't win. we can win fairly easily. if we won wisconsin that would be a big help.
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>> reporter: what has it meant in wisconsin do you think that you had the radio talk show hosts, the governor, so many people who are in the, quote/unquote, establishment who have actively said that they think that you're dangerous for their party and they want to work to make sure that you don't win. >> well, the governor has to say that because as you know i took him out. he was running for president and i was the one that took him out and i took him out rapidly and i never even asked for his endorsement or support, but i have the support of many people, chris christie, ben carson, people that ran and really ran much more successfully than he did, i have the support of many, many people. we just got the support of the 16,500 border patrol agents, which really is responsible for the border, the southern border. i mean, we have tremendous support from so many different levels, senator jeff sessions who cruz was trying to get on his camp because he is one of the most respected senators, he endorsed donald trump. we have tremendous support but i can understand why governor walker wouldn't want to support
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me because i was the one that took him out of the presidential ray race and it was pretty tough. he was expected to win and ended up leaving, one of the earliest to leave. i understand that, that's why i never even bothered to ask for his support. >> reporter: one of the toughest mountains for you seems to be with women now, in some areas you have 70% negatives with women. can you turn that around and what do you think is behind it besides obviously there were people that are concerned about your questions on abortion, concerned about the fact that you continue to support cory lewandowski. >> if you look at the tape what did cory lewandowski do? am i supposed to be loyal to a person because somebody filed something, because if you look at the complaint, i mean, people have -- we don't have to get into it now, but people have looked at that tape and are trying to say what did he do wrong? so i have to be loyal to people just like i will be loyal to the people of this country. when you analyze it, it's called give me a break. as far as women are concerned nobody respects women more than i do, not even close. nobody respects women more than
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i do. >> why can't they getting that message? >> i get a very, very unfair press having to do with women and many other things. phyllis does. >> i told that to charlie sykes last week, mr. trump. >> charlie sykes, this guy is third rate, a third rate talent and the governor you know the story with the governor, but the women i think that i am going to do very well with women. we just had a big meeting, many women at the meeting and they like me best because they say you're best with the military, with the borders, with security and i said i'm going to be best for women's health issues, much better than hillary, much better than anybody else. so i think we're going to do fantastically well with women. >> if you don't win here, donald -- mr. trump, will it be because you misread or your campaign misread the wisconsin electorate? do you think that perhaps you might have come in here knowing that you beat him and not been so tough on the governor, not
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been to tough on a radio talk show host who is popular here and well respected. >> the state is not doing particularly well, it's average compared to other states surrounding, the governinger has a good press, he gave me a plaque because i supported him a year ago, a year ago i was like establishment, i supported him, i gave him a lot of money because i liked him because he was a fighter, but the truth is his results are not very good, they are average, less than average in many cases, they're losing jobs and going to other countries and i let people know and let people know, too, when i was running against him as president and i talked about what's going on and it was something i didn't want to do, but he had to leave the race because when i brought out the facts he was unable to answer what i said. that being said, i've done great in wisconsin, i mean, the people have -- you've seen -- i've had rallies that have been fantastic, yesterday we had over 8,000 people trying to get into nl a airplane hangar and it was in the middle -- it was in an area that everyone said you
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couldn't get anybody and they had thousands and thousands of people from all over wisconsin coming. i think we're going to do well, a poll came out last night and it was interesting because it was the same pollster that polled south carolina that i ended up winning in a landslide, this was the poll that was the most accurate in south carolina and i believe also in new hampshire which i also won. so it's going to be interesting to see, but i think it's going to be a great day in wisconsin and i think we're going to do very well, i don't know, but i just -- based on the enthusiasm -- how do you think we're going to do in which? i think we're going to do very well. i hope so. >> reporter: finally no changes anticipated in your campaign staff? you have full confidence in everyone within it and you see no signs of any kind of unrest or infighting within your campaign? >> no, it's just the media again. i get the most unfair media. this is the first time i've been asked this question. nobody has called me about this. we are number one in every category, number one in delegates, number one in votes by millions, i don't mean by two votes, but by millions and millions of votes and i'm very
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happy. >> and you don't feel ill served, for example, to go to to a popular talk radio show and you said you didn't know they had been leading an anti-trump show. >> you go into the enemy camp sometimes. he is not a very smart guy, not a very bright guy. if you listen to the that show said you convinced me. i had many people call me that were going to vote against me. they listened to that sho. by the end of the show, and they wrote me, i have two or three letters. they wrote and tweeted and all of these, and they said by the end of that show, you have totally convinced me. i'm voting for trump. sometimes you go into unfriendly territory. that's part of the game. >> that's what you consider wisconsin to be? >> no, you said about a radio -- >> just the radio host. >> that's what i mean about the dishonest media. i'm asking you a question, allowingia to answer it. >> excuse me, you're asking me about a show host. i said he was unfriendly territory. you say is that wisconsin. it's so dishonest. no, no, that's called -- you know what's that's called
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dishonest media. i think i'm going to do great. >> going to new york and pennsylvania, what's the strategy -- >> i think i'm going to do great in wisconsin. the polls are showing me doing really, really well in new york, new jersey, pennsylvania, connecticut. i mean, it looks like we're going to have tremendous victories there. but right now, i'm interested right here. we'll see how we do tonight, and i think the results will surprise you. >> donald trump, thank you so much for your time, sir. so there you heard it from donald trump. in an area where frankly as a lot of people are coming through, this is going to be key to watch what happens in what they call the wow counties around here. donald trump, who has faced so much, as you know, chuck, of the governor, of the establishment in government here, in radio talk show. and obviously, so much at stake for him, for ted cruz, and also, frankly, for the republican establishment here in wisconsin. >> that's for sure. chris jansing, nice work. with him, never --
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>> got right in there. >> never easy with him, but well done. >> savannah, i thought it was interesting with what we heard from him. number one, he's there. hillary clinton's not going to be there today. she's decided she may or may not win. she probably has a better shot at winning that trump does, but trump knows he needs to do a better than expected showing. you to give him credit, he's sticking. >> we talked about the polls this morning. there are different polls that show different things, but he's probably looking at polls to show it to be tighter of a race. he feels, might as well get in there, press the flesh, do some rallies. >> the difference between him and cruz, trump actually won tonight, he could solidify -- it could totally knock out the never trump movement. cruz winning tonight just sort of bruises trump. so there is motivation for trump to stick. >> well, it will be interesting to see. what do you think of these polls? some of them show a wider distance between trump and cruz. >> i know the folks at marquette university. they did a poll that has
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traditionally been the most reliable poll in wisconsin. they're the ones who found this double-digit version for the first time. i'm a little skeptical of some of the online polling, but it's been, but trump does better in online polling than he does in some of the other polls. >> and an open primary. >> these have been recipes for trump success in the past. but we'll see if this is different. >> could be a late night for you. >> it is, and an early morning. >> always. >> why don't you come on over? >> no thanks. >> let's check with the clinton campaign. we have former two-term governor of michigan, jennifer granholm, good to see you. >> great to see you guys. >> let me start with wisconsin. it does seem as if the campaign is saying, well, we would like to win, but we can survive losing. is that a fair assessment? >> i think that's a fair assessment. we're facing some headwinds going into wisconsin as you all have pointed out. it is a whiter electorate. it is an open primary.
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a really progressive tradition. lots of college students. so she's been there. she's been there this weekend. she's fighting for every vote, but she, you know, unlike bernie sanders, she doesn't need to absolutely win wisconsin in order to maintain her delegate lead, obviously. i was looking at nate silver this morning, our guru of prognostication, and he was suggesting that she has to win -- he's got to win by something like 13%. he's got to win 48 delegates to her 38 delegates of the 82 dell -- 86 delegates in wisconsin. he's got to win ten more than she does just to try to stay on target for that state. then, of course, he's got to go and continue to win something like 60% in these next big primaries coming up. it's a harder road for him. >> governor, hasn't sanders consistently been underestimated by the clinton campaign? we were just talking about robby mook's memo back in february
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saying we're not going to win in february, fear not, but it will be over by the end of march. here we are in april. she's potentially not going to win tonight in wisconsin. it's not looking like an easy layup in new york either. >> yeah, nothing is a layup in this, as it has proven. obviously, hat is off to bernie sanders and his team for waging such a strong fight. she has never assumed that this was going to be an easy path. and she is out there swinging away. she will continue to do that. you know, this calendar, it's funny because obviously after super tuesday win, she lost michigan. everybody was saying, oh, a big problem for hillary clinton. then, on the 15th of march, she wins those big states, and everybody said, oh, bernie sanders is out. we knew that the way the calendar is set up, these last couple weeks of march and into tonight, would be a tough slug. even up to this weekend with wyoming. but once you get to big prima primaries and diverse states, since she has built a campaign
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that looks like america, that is diverse itself, that really takes advantage of this new rising majority, then she does better. >> you know, it's interesting. she seems to be taking a veiled shot at bernie sanders for not being a democrat his whole life. why should that matter? he chose to be a democrat. shouldn't that be celebrated? >> we welcome everybody who joins the democratic party, early, late, whatever. day of, that's great. but her point is that she has been raising money for people up and down the ticket. this is why, you know, when you ask people, democrats, who do you think is most likely to beat trump or cruz in the fall? she overwhelmingly wins. why is this? it's because she through the process has been vetted and they have spent millions of dollars against her, where as bernie sanders hasn't had a national campaign where he's had millions of dollars against him. all the democrats believe that because of their peernls, they know that. we are welcoming obviously him and all of the supporters into the democratic party. we have to keep them there, but
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you have to win races up and down the ballot. she has been there supporting democrats her entire elected life and before, and i think that makes a difference. >> they're playing our song. >> we're playing you out like the oscars. governor, thank you so much. that does it for us this hour on msnbc. i have a grit idea. why don't we do this tomorrow at 9:00 a.m.? >> okay, twist my arm. >> no sleep till brooklyn. >> i would like to get a couple hours between now and the new york primary. reminder, our coverage of the wisconsin primary starts tonight at 5:00 p.m. special edition of "meet the press" daily, the first round of exit polls from wisconsin. we'll report on them first, and special live team coverage at 8:00 tonight. savannah will be watching until 1:00 or 2:00 in the morning to prepare for the "today" show. >> i never miss a chuck todd live shot if i can help it. steve kornacki picks up next. ♪
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good tuesday morning to you. a super tuesday here on msnbc. and it is a big one today in the race for president. i'm steve kornacki. 42 delegates up for grabs on the republican side in wisconsin tonight. 86 on the democratic side. and the polls are now open. it is primary day in the badger state. every candidate finding themselves clawing for every delegate, every vote, every bit of momentum that they can put together. for donald trump, the big magic number in this campaign, of course, is 1,237. as in 1,237 delegates. he's got to clear that number in the primaries, or he risks being shut out at the republican convention this summer. with the anti-trump fervor reaching a critical point among
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establishment republicans over the past week, conventional wisdom says if trump doesn't get the nomination on that first ballot in cleveland, then maybe ted cruz, maybe john kasich, maybe somebody else even, is going to sweep in and take it on a later ballot. so with that in mind, trump stopping by a diner in wisconsin this morning, as the voting was under way, and our own chris jansing caught up with him just moments ago. >> we feel great. i mean, the turnout has been fantastic. i think we're going to have a great day. a phenomenal poll come out last night. a pollster that called south carolina, i wasn't supposed to win south carolina. we won in really a landslide, chris, and we feel really good about this. >> we're going to play all of that interview chris jansing just had with donald trump on the ground in wisconsin in just a few minutes. now, though, for trump's big opponent in wisconsin, ted cruz, and more broadly, for the entire stop donald trump movement on the republican side, they're
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looking for tonight to be a turning point. they're looking to derail donald trump in wisconsin, to stall his momentum nationally. and then to start knocking him off in other states between now and june. to deprive him of that magic delegate number. then, there's also a democratic race tonight in wisconsin. bernie sanders running out of opportunities to stop hillary clinton nationally. but he's got a golden opportunity to put a win on the board here in wisconsin tonight. then after that, two weeks from now, sanders placing a large bet on new york. but he is going to need a big win out of wisconsin tonight to get momentum, to prove he has staying power, and to make new york a race. our latest nbc/survey monkey online tracking poll this morning shows clinton pulling away a little bit from sanders nationally. a two-point jump for her over the last week. a nine-point lead. again, that's the national horse race there on the democratic side. on the republican side, here are
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the national horse race numbers from our poll, donald trump, a slight drop in the last week. but still a comfortable 17-point advantage over ted cruz. but of course, you add those cruz/kasich numbers together, it's a different story. that is the theory of the stop trump movement. you add the nontrumps together and you get a very different race. the polls that matter today, though, they are the ones, the real polls in wisconsin. the voters actually going and casting ballots. all the big questions hanging over the race this morning, can donald trump turn this into a win? can he come from behind and put a win on the board in wisconsin? that would go a long way to ending the suspense on the republican side and to making him the presumptive nominee, or is ted cruz poised for a huge night? out there covering all of it for us today, chris jansing in waukesha, and hallie jackson in milwaukee. we're going to start with you, chris jansing. you're at a polling station in waukesha, wisconsin, critical area there, right around milwaukee. you spoke with donald trump this morning.
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the polling news has not been good for him out of wisconsin in the last week. how optimistic is he he could actually pull out a "w" tonight? >> you would never know the bad press, the bad polling listening to donald trump who gave me a wide-ranging interview talking about things that we have not had a chance to ask him about before. including about these reports of in-fighting within his campaign, an extensive article yesterday in "new york" magazine that said, and i'm quoting it, at trump tower, rival staff members are vying to exert control over the campaign in a power struggle that is every bit as vitriolic as trump himself. the battle lines are drawn between the longtime aides who have advised trump for years and the new hires who joined the staff in recent months. here's what he told me. >> it's just the media again. i get the most unfair media. nobody ever even called me. this is the first time i have been asked this question. nobody has called me about this.
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we're number one in every category, number one in delegates, in votes by millions. i don't mean by two votes. by millions and millions of votes. and i'm very happy. >> but you'll notice that he addressed many of the questions about how he's doing here in much broader terms. not really taking on the fact that not only is he down in the polls, but that he has actually made some serious missteps if you talk to longtime party insiders, republican insiders on the ground. granted, these are people who have actively worked against him. but he didn't ever acknowledge at any point that any member of his staff had given him bad guidance, for example, when he wept into those radio interviews and clearly didn't seem to know that the people who were doing the interviews were the people who were behind the stop-trump campaign. when i asked him ability the very high negatives with women, which are in the 70s here in wisconsin and many other places around the country, he simply brushed it off by saying he meets with a lot of women and women love him.
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he loves women. those are the kinds of things that donald trump is starting to find here in wisconsin, are getting him into trouble when you talk to voters, but certainly when you talk to the establishment here. they think he just doesn't have clear answers, exacting answers. that he isn't responsive, whether it's on policy issues or whether it's on political issues. so really interesting to hear donald trump, who in spite of all the odds seems to think he has a good chance here and feels good about going on to new york and pennsylvania. this is going to be a place to watch. maybe not surprising he showed up here in waukesha, if he was going to be anywhere, for are three counties, as you well know, around the milwaukee area. the most republican in the country, so predictable here. i think you can take a look around ladder five, the lines have been pretty steady all morning long. they think they're going to get 40%, which would be a new record voter turnout here.
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but in this polling place, in this county, they think it could be 60%, even 70%. so this is going to be one of those critical areas to look at to see not just if ted cruz can go forward and have this argument that he has made a dent into what seemed like the inevitability of donald trump, but also a lot at stake for party leaders. >> all right, chris jansing, and you're right. people look nationally at wisconsin. they wonder how scott walker became governor, that's where you're standing right now, the heart of the scott walker base in wisconsin. we'll see how they turn out tonight. meanwhile, hallie jackson with the cruz campaign. hallie, play this out for us. obviously, ted cruz needs to win wisconsin tonight, but beyond that, to go forward, get momentum out of this, deny trump the nomination and win it for himself. where would ted cruz go from tonight if he gets the win he's looking for? >> look at where he's talking about, even as he's in wisconsin, steve. you heard him say that he
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believes wisconsin looks a lot more like indiana and pennsylvania than other states where he's done well. which is a hint to where the campaign is looking to moving forward. also looking to a place like new york, obviously, the next primary up. even though a campaign aide has acknowledged that looks pretty bumpy for ted cruz, like a more natural fit for donald trump. i'm told the campaign is certainly not conceding new york to trump, even though it is sort of his home state, at least one of them, that and florida. the cruz campaign is feeling optimistb about their chances in wisconsin. they think they will pull off a double-digit win. that's key moving forward because cruz has to point to somebody like the moderate groups here, somebody like the somewhat conservatives. that's what we're going to be looking for in the exit polls to make the argument that he can in fact move forward, beat donald trump, and then do well in a general election. not to underestimate the role of john kasich in the race. he could pick up delegates in the congressional district by madison where he's been doing well, where he's been focusing.
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there's a lot at play. you talk about scott walker out on the campaign trail for ted cruz. interesting to note his role in all of this, just because he is so popular here. remember the type of republican in some of these counties around milwaukee, steve. they are engaged. they have been through recall foits. they have been through the union fights. they are politically active. many of them, and that has fit with folks we have been talking to. conservatives in and around milwaukee, in these counties like waukesha county who say, yeah, i'm paying attention. i know what's going on. you head out into the more rural areas and there's a little less of that which is why you see more trump support in the north and west parts of wisconsin. there's a lot at play. for turnout, there were predictions maybe it would be snowy or rainy, but the weather is perfect. it's chilly but sunny, which obviously helps on a day like today when it's primary day. >> sounds like some good voting weather. hallie jackson in milwaukee. >> let me turn to e.j. dionne, longtime political reporter, now a contributor to the "washington
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post," and he wrote a very provocative column about the wisconsin race. here's the title. this time it really is the end of trump, really. e.j., with a title like that, we had to get you on the show. look, from the very beginning, donald trump in his opening press conference to start this campaign made the comments about mexicans and people said that's the beginning of the end. it's been predicted a thousand times since. it has not come to pass. why is it different now? >> thank you for reading that headline, which i didn't write, but i absolutely love. on my column there. look, what i argue in that column is that what everybody said or what a lot of people said from the very beginning about trump was true. which is that he is unprepared to be president. he hasn't thought through very much. he took four or five, depending on how you want to count it, four or five positions on abortion last week. so much of what he says shows that he has not put in the time
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or the effort to be a serious candidate. now, because he has endured a lot of people are afraid of saying outright all those things are still true. i quote the great yogi berra line about losing because they made the wrong mistakes. i think the wrong mistake now would be to say just because he's survived doesn't mean those things weren't true. what you got last week was a very concentrated form of all the reasons why trump is not a plausible candidate, and in particular, you have this utter collapse of trump among women. women voters are not going to vote for donald trump against hillary clinton. the polls show him losing by a margin of 21% to 27%. and so i think we saw the unraveling last week. and it will continue. and just for excitement on television, i think just as we had in 1964 on the republican
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side in 1972 on the democratic side, california will be armageddon. i think we'll go all the way to the end of california, that's going to be the big fight. and i am betting he's going to lose that fight. >> because that's the thing. we're looking at tonight. if the dire predictions are true, at least in terms of trump's prospects and he loses by double digits, i look ahead to the next contest, new york, his home state. he's poised to gobble up all or almost all of the delegates there. there's still an opportunity here that donald trump gets close to the republican nomination, and i guess that raises the question, if republic republican leaders are as scared of the poll numbers you're describing, if he comes out with 1,000, 1,100 delegates, getting the most votes in all of these primaries when you add them together, that's still going to be hard for them to say no to, isn't it? >> i have been watching very carefully when you do those wonderful maps with your electronic chalkboard, and he
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doesn't have any room to lose very much before he falls substantially below. i think the issue is, is he winning at the end or not? two big fights, california, as i said, also new jersey, where you wonder, does chris christie play for him or against him in that state at this point. if trump were winning at the end, then i think he could make a plausible case that, look, the people have spoken and they want me. but if he's losing at the end, which is my guess, just sort of the idea behind that column which is he's beginning to fall apart, if he's losing at the end, it's a lot harder for him to say i'm the choice of the people. and a lot easier for republicans who don't want him, still a majority of the party, as you suggested earlier when you add up the cruz and kasich votes, then i think he has a much harder time saying he's the choice of the people. it doesn't mean there won't be hell to pay from the trump
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constituency if he's denied the nomination, but i think the case for those who want to deny him the nomination is strengthened if he's losing at the end. >> all right, e.j. dionne from the "washington post," thanks for the time. >> great to be with you always. >> and for the democrats, the debate about debates here in new york, that's the next battleground after wisconsin. well, that debate over debates is now settled after several days of very public back and forth between the candidates. they have agreed to meet before the voters go to the polls in new york. and while there is still wisconsin to get through today, the candidates know how important new york is. and when we come back, actor, wisconsin native, and hillary clinton supporter bradley witferred is going to join us. why do so many businesses rely on the us postal service? because when they ship with us,
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i think the first test that you should hold anybody running for president to see whether or not they meet is can they actually make your life better? i want to tell you what i want to do because i want you to hold me accountable for doing it. >> hillary clinton hoping to fend off bernie sanders, who is going to try to extend his winning streak today in wisconsin. this after taking five out of the last six contests on the democratic side. now, polls in the badger state show sanders with a slight advantage heading into the voting today. and in the latest national nbc news/survey monkey poll, he has a leg up on her with a key group in wisconsin. he has a whopping 20-point lead with independents who lean democratic. this is an important group in states that have these open primaries where anybody can vote in either party's primary. overall nationally, clinton
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still leads sanders by nine points. that's a slight uptick for clinton over the last one from a six-point lead a week ago to nine points nationally. kristen welker joins me now here on set to talk about where the clinton race stands right now with bernie sanders. so look, hillary clinton is not in wisconsin today. she's in new york. new york votes two weeks from now. wisconsin votes today. are they raising the white flag here? >> think to some extent they are. it tells you everything you need to know about how the clinton campaign feels about wisconsin. they have been lowering expectations there for weeks. and senator sanders heading into today still has a lead in the polls. a single-point lead, but one clinton official telling me they're bracing for the possibility they could lose by as many as double digits. that would be significant because if senator sanders wins, he wins delegates. if he wins by double digits, he wins more delegates. he has more momentum. for the clinton campaign, it's all about new york. she has been vigorously campaigning here. former president bill clinton
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campaigning here as well. toold, she has one event in brooklyn and she's fund-raising tonight. she doesn't have one of those big rallies you typically have when you have votes. that's to some extent to turn the page on what is going to be a difficult chapter. as you point out, senator sanders won five out of the past six states. so the focus now on new york, she still has a lead here in new york, but senator sanders has been closing the gap with her to some extent. they're not concerned about new york, but they want to defend what is her adopted home turf, if you will. >> they're in this position where still, if you look at the delegate math, it's a very solid lead for hillary clinton. very hard to see bernie sanders catching her. it is not hard to see, though, when you look ahead to the future contests between now and june, bernie sanders putting a lot more wins on the board between now and then. so the clinton campaign is caught in this place, it seems, where they want to be focusing on uniting the party, turning to the republicans, but they're still going to be losing states clear through june. >> a memo had gone out saying we expect to have the race locked up by the end of march.
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we're now into april. i think they are frustrated by the fact she hasn't been able to pivot. as you point out, there are more states he can win. by the way, we learned yesterday that he outpaced her in front raising last month by $15 million. he has no reason to get out of the race, but the bottom line is the math. she has what is, they like to say, a nearly insurmountable delegate lead. she has a larger delegate lead than barack obama had in 2008. they are in a pretty comfortable lead. >> kristen welkeric thank you for that. >> clinton calls on hollywood's version of the white house for campaign event at an event at the university of wisconsin in madison. she was joined by a former white house deputy chief of staff who you might remember from "the west wing." >> voters are leaving part of their ballots blank. they don't even know it. >> explain this to me like i'm a 2-year-old, and try to do it like you're not. >> actor and wisconsin native bradley whitford. he joins clinton in madison
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along with the president of planned parenthood, cecile richards. joining me now is bradley whitford, live in our l.a. bureau. thanks for taking a few minutes this morning. >> my pleasure. >> you're an actor. you're a wisconsin native, though. what do you make of this? you're a hillary clinton supporter. you're looking at your home state. it's got to spotlight today. an awful lot of bernie sanders supporters there. what do you make of that? >> there's a lot of support for bernie. i certainly understand bernie's appeal. with me, it comes down to a very simple case of hillary being by far the most qualified candidate to run for president in my lifetime. my experience of hillary goes back to her working the children's defense fund, marion wright aidalman, her constant support for women's rights. i have two daughters. for reproductive rights. as a senator, she sponsored eight pieces of legislation.
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she wasn't just a reliable vote, as bernie was. she has been at the forefront of protecting our most vulnerable citizens. fighting for health care. i think she's the most prepared person by far. and i support her enthusiastically. >> why has that -- everything you just laid out there, particularly on the experience front, why has that not resonated with -- look, she is leading right now, but there's still a very significant chunk of the democratic base that that's clearly not enough for. she's lost, i think, 13 or 14 states to sanders so far, could well lose tonight. why is that not enough for so many democrats? >> well, i think it's very easy to be cynical about the political process. it's a very difficult thing to watch. i think it's very easy on the left to fall in love with someone who doesn't have, perhaps, as dirty a uniform, who hasn't been as battle tested as hillary has. but there's no question in
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wisconsin, i actually said that a lot of people, i don't think, understand that hillary outbernied bernie her entire life in terms of pushing the progressive agenda. and idealism is more than just talking about it. idealism is knowing what you can actually get done and getting it done. and hillary has been a champion in the progressive arena. my entire adult life. >> i got to ask you one west wing question here. the president jed bartlett from that show, he was sort of for liberals a shadow president during the bush years. if he was looking at this race, if that character was looking at this race, where do you think he would come down? >> there's no doubt in my mind that hillary would be president bartlett's choice. she's -- nobody is more prepared to take that position on day
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one. so there's no doubt in my mind, i know this may be controversial, but yes, on behalf of jed bartlett, i want to endorse hillary clinton. >> there it is. "west wing" actor, wisconsin native, bradley whitford. thanks for taking a few minutes. >> thank you very much. coming up, we're going to go back on the ground to wisconsin. voters are out and casting their ballots as we speak. we're just a few short hours from our first round of exit polling data. i'm going to take a walk over to the big board and we're going to take a close look at what to expect. a key thing to watch as those votes come in tonight. that's right after this.
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showing him lagging behind ted cruz in the state, taking a look there at the average of all the polls. trump about four, five points behind ted cruz there going into tonight. but trump still has the opportunity in wisconsin to pick up some delegates. that's the way it works on the republican side. you can lose states but really the question of whether you're losing comes down to delegates. we'll show you how they do it in wisconsin because this really is the story to watch as the votes come in. it's not just who wins. it's this. wisconsin has a total of 42 delegates on the republican side. if you win the state, if ted cruz does win the state tonight, you get 18 of those delegates automatically, but the real action is for the other 24 delegates. 24 delegates. how are they given out? they're given out by congressional district. that's what you're looking at. each color is one of the eight congressional districts of wisconsin. eight congressional districts. each one, three delegates. if you win the district, you get three delegates. so, when you start to look at the map, what we have seen in
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the polling is right here around milwaukee, and this touches this milwaukee media market touches basically four congressional districts. this has been the heart of ted cruz's support in the state. this is where donald trump has done the worst. this is where if the polls are right, ted cruz is going to do the best tonight. if you look around madison, if you're john kasich, he's still in the race. if he's going to do well anywhere tonight, it's going to be around madison. he could potentially pick up the three delegates in that congressional district. if you're donald trump, you're really looking up here, and maybe you're looking around green bay. there's three congressional districts in particular you look at and say maybe trump has got a shot at these. if you're trump and you lose state-wide tonight, if you can win those three districts, what would that mean? you would still walk away with nine. if you could pick off madison, you could still get 12 in defeat. the flip side for trump, if he gets beat by cruz here, if he were to lose to kasich there, he could walk away with zero delegates tonight. remember, this is all about in the end whether donald trump can
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get 1,237 this summer. every delegate he can squeeze out of this state tonight is huge for him. every delegate that kasich and cruz can deny him is huge for them. so that's going to be the big story. we're going to be watching that tonight as the votes come in here on msnbc. and joining me now is a reporter who knows wisconsin and all of these congressional districts very well. mary is a political reporter at the milwaukee journal sentinel. she joins us now. so let me ask you this. basic question here. ted cruz's campaign is saying they think they're headed towards a pretty big win tonight in wisconsin. a double-digit win. is that what you're seeing on the ground? >> you know, there has been a very vocal never-trump, stop-trump movement here, especially among establishment republicans, conservative talk radio, scott walker has endorsed cruz. there's been a big push. i think they see wisconsin as their last stand. i think if they're going to stop trump, it's got to be here.
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>> we showed the macha area there, the suburbs around milwaukee, densely populated, heavily republican areas. the polls saying that's where donald trump is doing particularly badly. what is it about that area that has trump in such trouble there? >> we call those the wow counties. waukesha is obviously a conservative stronghold. there's been a big movement to support ted cruz that is walker territory. he has dropped in the polls state-wide, but he continues to do well in that area. and i think that they are really mobilizing around ted cruz and trying to stop trump here. in that especially in the wow counties. >> good night for donald trump. we were saying maybe he could win three, maybe he could win four of those congression aal districts. he's still saying she has a shot to pull the upset in the state tonight overall. is that something you could see realistically? >> that would -- he's saying that. on sunday, he told us he's
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predicting a surprise victory. i think surprise would be the key word there. i would be very surprised if donald trump wins state-wide. however, i do think he can prevent a shutout. i think he could do well up north, and you know, i would be extremely surprised and very, very doubtful that he could win in southeastern wisconsin. i think up north, he could walk away with some delegates. i could see kasich doing well in the madison area. that's obviously a liberal area and a democratic stronghold, and bernie territory. among republicans. you see a lot more moderate republicans who would go for somebody like john kasich. >> again, the overall question of who wins the state and the real question, who is winning the eight congressional districts. mary, thanks for helping us shed some light on that, appreciate it. >> thanks for having me. >> all right. and coming up, more of chris jansing's interview just in the last hour with donald trump. she caught up with him on the trail in wisconsin. trump denying reports of in-fighting in his campaign.
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to make people and organizations safer. polling station in waukesha, wisconsin, earlier today. that is where our own chris jansing caught up with the candidate and got to ask him a host of questions about all sorts of issues, including his troubles with women and the state of his campaign. take a listen. >> i want to give you a chance to answer these reports that there's a lot of infighting in your campaign, that it's a state of somewhat disarray. >> i haven't heard those reports. we have a great campaign. i'm number one by a lot. millions more votes than cruz or anybody else. i have millions more votes, as you know. i have almost 300 more delegates. i have not heard anything about infighting. >> it's being reported. there are people within your campaign who are suggesting -- >> i'm the only -- i doubt that. >> you feel confident that your campaign is all working
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together? none of the people who have been -- >> are we number one? >> you are number one, but will you -- >> do we have millions more votes than anybody else? will we win today, i can't tell you, but we're going to have a great turnout. i think we're going to do very well. >> one of the toughest mountains for you seems to be women in some areas. you have 70%, 77% negatives with women. can you turn that around and what do you think is behind it besides obviously there are people who are very concerned about your positions on abortion, very concerned about fact you continue to support corey lewandowski. >> if you look at the tape, what decori lewandowski do? am i supposed to be loyal to a person, or because somebody filed something? if you look at the complaint, we don't have to get into it now, but people have looked at the tape and saying what did he do wrong? i have to be loyal to people like i will be loyal to the people of this country. when you analyze it, it's called give me a break. as far as women are concerned, nobody respects women more than i do. not even close. nobody respects women more than
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i do. >> why aren't they getting that message? >> because i get a very unfair press. a very, very unfair press, have to do with women and many other things. that's right. phyllis does. yeah. and charlie sykes, this guy is third rate. a third-rate talent. frankly, and the governor, you know, the story with the governor. but the women, i think that i'm going to do very well with women. we just had a big meeting, many women at the meeting. they like me best because they say you're best with the military, you're best with the borders. you're best for security. i said i'm going to be best for women's health issues. much better than hillary, much better than anybody else. i think we're going to do fantastically well with women. >> if you don't win here, mr. trump, will it be because you misread or your campaign misread the wisconsin electorate? do you think that perhaps you might have come in here knowing that you beat him and not been so tough on the governor? not been so tough on --
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>> we'll have to see. >> a radio talk show host who is very popular here and very well respected. >> the state is not door particularly well. it's average compared to other states surrounding. the governor has a good press. the governor is a nice man. he gave me a plaque because i supported him a year ago. a year ago, i was like establishment, i supported him. i gave him a lot of money because i liked him because he was a fighter. the truth is his results aren't very good. they're very average, even less than average in many cases. they're losing jobs, they're going to other countries. i let people know, and i let people know when i was running against him as president and i talked about what's going wrong, and it was something i didn't want to do, but he had to leave the race because when i brought out the facts, he was unable to answer what i said. that being said, i've done great in wisconsin. i mean, the people have -- you've seen. i had rallies that have been fantastic. yesterday, we had over 8,000 people trying to get into an airplane hangar. it was in the middle -- in an area that everybody said you
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couldn't get anybody. we had thousands and thousands of people from all over wisconsin coming. i think we're going to do well. a poll came out last night, and it was interesting because it was the same pollster that polled south carolina that i ended up winning in a landslide. this was the poll that was most accurate in south carolina and i believe also in new hampshire, which i also won. it's going to be interesting to see, but i think it's going to be a great day in wisconsin and i think we're going to do well. i don't know, but based on the enthusiasm. how do you think we're going to do in wisconsin? i think we're going to do really well. i hope so. >> finally, no changed anticipated in your campaign staff? you have full confidence in everyone within it and you see no signs of any kind of unrest or infighting within your campaign? >> just the media again. i get the most unfair media. nobody eefrb even called me. nobody's called me about this. we're number one in every c catego category, number one in delegates, in votes by millions, not two votes, by millions and millions of votes. i'm very happy.
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>> you don't feel ill-served to go on to a very popular talk radio show and said you didn't know they had been leading an anti-trump charge. >> i don't mind that. you go into inthe enemy camp sometimes. he's not a very smart guy, not a very bright guy. if you listen to the entire show, you would have said donald trump totally won that debate. i was on the show for 15 empties. and everybody that listened to that show said you convinced me. i had many people call me that were going to vote against me. they listened to the show. by the end of the show, they wrote me, too. i have two or three letters. they wrote and tweeted and all of these, and they said by the end of that show, you have totally convinced me i'm voting for trump. so sometimes you go into unfriendly territory. that's part of the game. >> and that's what you consider wisconsin to be? >> no, you said about -- >> you're talking ability the radio host. >> that's what i mean about the dishonest media. >> i'm afging you a question, allowing you to answer it. >> excuse me, you're asking me about a show host.ly
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territory. >> you also talked -- >> it's so dishonest. no, no. that's called -- you know what's that called? dishonest media, dishonest reporting. >> going into new york and pennsylvania, what's the strategy? >> excuse me, i think i'm going to do great in wisconsin. the polls are showing me doing really, really well in new york, new jersey, pennsylvania, connecticut. i mean, it looks like we're going to have tremendous victories there. but right now, i'm interested right here. we'll see how we do tonight, and i think the results will surprise you. >> all right, that was donald trump with our own chris jansing. now coming up, ted cruz is willing to taste some famous wisconsin cheese on a campaign stop. but he draws the line at wearing cheese. we will tell you why right after this break. at ally bank, no branches equals great rates. it's a fact. kind of like bill splitting equals nitpicking. but i only had a salad.
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on monday, as republicans spent most of the day making their final pushes through the state. ahead of today's voting. for ted cruz, that meant making a stop at kenosha's mars cheese castle with governor scott walker. and with cruz's 7-year-old daughter caroline, who you see in the cheese hat. but cruz made it clear, as much as he wants to win wisconsin today, there are just some things he is not willing to do for a vote. >> can you put it on your head? >> no, my girls will. >> why not? >> there is an iron clad rule of politics which is no funny hats. any hat by definition is defined as a funny hat. michael dukakis demonstrated that powerfully when he put on a helmet and rode in a tank. i will cheer on the hats of others, but -- >> don't you think the people of wisconsin want to see you in a cheese head? >> i think the people of wisconsin wear their cheese heads so powerfully i would not presume to intrude in the elegance with which the people of wisconsin wear those hats.
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>> should ask him what he thinks of the trump make america great again hats. liesk pictures at a polling place in green bay, just one of many where wisconsin voters are casting their ballots right now in that state's primary, and potentially, depending on the result tonight, potentially changing the course of the race. we're going to take you across the state as we continue to count down to the polls closing. that's coming up. if you're going to make a statement... make sure it's an intelligent one. ♪ the all-new audi a4, with available virtual cockpit. ♪ whewhat does it look like?ss, is it becoming a better professor by being a more adventurous student? is it one day giving your daughter the opportunity she deserves? is it finally witnessing all the artistic wonders
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they're going to have to do something from the outside now. it's page, off balance. puts it up. impossible! how did he do that. ties the game with 4.7 seconds to go. >> villanova trying to go length of the court. with archie. three seconds, at midcourt. gives it to jenkins for the championship. yes! villano
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villanova. the national champions. >> well, we had to get that one in, didn't we? a buzzer beater for the ages, lifting villanova to a 77-74 victory over north carolina, for the ncaa title last night. what a scene in houston. you see villanova celebrating. i could go on and on about this. we'll be talking ability that 50 years from now. we had to show you that one. i'll be watching again as soon as i get off the air. back to the day at hand in politics. polls have been open now in wisconsin for about three hours. they're going to close at 8:00 local time. remember, wisconsin is central time. that will be 9:00 here on the east coast. there is a lot at stake. we have been talking about it all hour. a lot at stake on both sides of the aisle. our team of reporters are on the ground at polling places around the state. jacob soboroff at the university of wisconsin. that is in madison. tony dokoupil is in green bay with more blue-collar labor voters up there. jacob, we're going to start with you in the college town of madison. what are you seeing, what are
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you hearing as the votes are cast? >> so, straight up, steve, it's not quite as exciting here as the game last night, but what is exciting at least to me is i've got my official hot pink election observer sticker here at the memorial library at the university of wisconsin madison. i want to bring you inside the polling place right now. things are getting under way, and most likely, if it was me in college, i would still be sleeping which is probably why it's slightly quiet here. i was told by greta and peggy who are welcoming people into the room, there was quite a long line when people started out this morning. remember, wisconsin is a state with same-day registration. this is the area where you do that if you're coming for the first time to vote. if you're already registered to vote, you do that on this side of the room, which we're seeing people do. here's somebody renlsterring in the m to z category, which is the category i would register in. you get your ballot, come to the voting location and drop it into this electronic counting machine. only 73 votes have come so far.
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this is the center of voting in madison, wisconsin, because 43,000 people go to school in this location. but it's also the center of a major controversy about voting i.d. there's a new voter i.d. law that has just gone into effect here. you have to have this. the school has given this to students because their student i.d.s will not work. this is something my colleague tony dokoupil has been doing a lot of reporter on. for now, i want to toss it to tony who is up in green bay. >> thank you, jacob. nothing could be quite as exciting as that game last night, but we're witnessing the busiest morning at the biggest polling station in green bay. take a look at this line. people in line for 20, 30 minutes at a clip. this is at a very important polling locations for campaigns on the republican side and democratic side. donald trump down in the polls. if he's going to pull ahead, we'll see signs at places like this. bernie sanders, if he's going to keep the lead over hillary clinton, we'll also see him extend it or keep it at places like this. there are wild cards in play.
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one, same-day registration. behind me, maybe you can't quite see, there are tables set up all day lock. there are been people situated around the tables, filling out same-day voter registration forms. the other wild card, the new i.d. law. the new i.d. law, you need an i.d. now in wisconsin to vote. the bernie sanders campaign all the time you hear them saying if turnout is big, we will do well. if it's not big, we will not do well. they have an ofrl monitor to make sure the i.d. law does not obstruct the law. what are you watching for? >> i'm making sure people aren't turned away from the polls when they do have correct i.d. >> you mentioned misinformation up on the radio this morning? >> yes, there was a radio station that put out that student i.d.s are not correct identification when they are. >> thank you very much. so some confusion already this morning. like i said, this line is very long. people are waiting for 20 or 30 minutes. and when the evening rush comes, it could be even longer.
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something to monitor throughout the day. back to you. >> tony dokoupil in green bay. jacob soboroff in madison, thanks to both of you. that's going to do it for this hour of msnbc live. i'm going to see you right back here at 6:00 p.m. eastern time. part of our special live coverage tonight of the wisconsin primary, and tamron hall is going to pick up our coverage next. e*trade is all about seizing opportunity. and i'd like to... cut. so i'm gonna take this opportunity to direct. thank you, we'll call you. evening, film noir, smoke, atmosphere...
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will they be looking at my hair? won't be the same without you bro. ♪ when it's go, the new choice privileges gets you there faster. and now, stay two times and you can earn a free night. book now at choicehotels.com good morning, everyone. i'm tamarron hall coming to you live from our msnbc election headquarters in new york. let me show you live pictures from a polling location in milwaukee as voters there cast their ballots in the important primary going on right now. voting will continue until 9:00 p.m. eastern time. 8:00 central. and the outcome could change the course of the presidential race. is this the game changer? and just over an hour ago,

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